Tuesday, September 13, 2005

Olympians, Lords of Kobol, and the Cylon Models

There were 12 Olympian gods, which, as far as I can tell, correspond to the Lords of Kobol. One of my pet theories is that the 12 Cylon models correspond to the Lords of Kobol/Olympians.

Aphrodite-goddess of love, beauty, fertility
Six (made evident by the cover to the British DVD), Boomer (gave birth), or Ellen (if she is indeed a Cylon)

Apollo-god of prophesy, music, healing
Apollo (by name only), maybe Leobon (his prophesying to Comm. Adama, Roslyn, and Starbuck)

Ares- god of war
Possibly Apollo or any other Cylon on the Battlestar

Artemis-virgin goddess of the hunt, helped women in childbirth
Simon (obvious reasons, this one is the one I'm most certain on)

Athena-goddess of crafts and domestic arts, war
Dualla (if she is a Cylon)

Demeter-goddess of agriculture, sister of Zeus
Not sure on this one, most likely is Boomer--"mining" background

Dionysus-god of wine
Ellen (if she is a Cylon) for obvious reasons

Hephaestus-god of fire and crafts, lame in one leg
Doral (exploded on board, P.R. "craft" man)

Hera-goddess of marriage, wife of Zeus
Six if Baltar is Zeus

Hermes-messenger of the gods, guide of dead souls to underworld
Perhaps Gaius ("I am an instrument of the gods") or D'Anna (cinematography=messenger)

Poseidon-god of the sea, earthquakes and horses
Clueless on this one.

Zeus-supreme god of the Olympians, father of a lot of god-human hybrids
This could be Gaius, due to the Six "I am the mother, you are the father" speech. In this case, Six would be Hera.
This could also be Boomer (even though she is a woman) because she gave birth to the Cylon-human hybrid, and Zeus was active in god-hybrid children production.

21 Comments:

Blogger Brian said...

I applaud the degree of obsessive academic geekiness displayed in this post.

That having been said, I'm not convinced that the 12 models correspond with the Lords of Kobol, as the Cylons detest the heresy of man's Polytheism. Rather, I suspect that the 12 models may be more closely linked to the 12 colonies and their zodiac counterparts.

Or, 12 could just be a literarily thematic number. 12 tribes, 12 lords, 12 models…

8:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think you are on the right track, but I have a slightly different interpretation.

Aphrodite - Boomer, not 6. Remember that Aphrodites is creating discord between the mortals, which is what Boomer is doing.

Apollo - Lee Adama himself. Like Starbuck, he has a destiny to fulfill...

Ares - dunno, maybe Helo, for having an affair with Aphrodites / Boomer

Artemis - Most certainly Starbuck, as Appollo's sister... plus she is the one who finds the Arrow... of course she is no longer a virgin but hey...

Athena - I would tend to think that this one is actually Six, providing guidance and wisdom to men (Gaius)

Demeter - Maybe our new cylon journalist / warrior princess

Dionysus - dunno

Hephaestus - dunno, maybe the Chief, who fits the bill quite well, and who is married to Aphrodites afer all !!!

Hera - Six, obviously Six, as the Queen of cylons...

Hermes - Maybe Simon, since he is the bringer of information... some kind of messenger

Poseidon - dunno

Zeus - Adama, Commander Adama. The man who makes up the whole thing about Earth, and look who conveniently well the Cylons know the prophecy...

I think the cylons are in this to guide humanity to a one true God. They decided to wipe it out first, before forcing it to begin anew, on different basis.

Adama, Lee, Starbuck, Boomer are all unknowing cylons and part of the plan.

12:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

sorry for the confusion.
I meant Hera is Six.
Athena, I don't know...

12:47 PM  
Blogger starchild said...

I think this is a really cool concept... there's got to be something to it. With two references to these gods so far.... that I remember: the tomb of athena and arrow of apollo. So I'm guessing that you're right about the link between the 12 models and the 12 gods, maybe just as a device... not necessarily something we find out about.

I think Sharon is the cylon in charge, and so I would cast her as Zeus... also in keeping with the show's gender changing.

So Hera is the Goddess of marriage... and wife of zeus? I can't make any sense out of the plot if Helo is a cylon, but the name Helo is kind of like the name Hera and he's the father of zeus's baby.... and by the way his head is shaped like the other male human cylons.

I don't think CSD ("Cigarette Smoking Doctor") is a cylon, but if he was, would he be Hephaestus? God of fire, for lighting cigarettes, crafts meaning medicine, and though not lame in one leg, he is kind of slow.

I think you're right on Simon/Artemis, with another gender change.... D'anna/Hermes, and probably Leobon/apollo and LeeAdama/Ares... despite his call sign.

I'm not so sure about Six being aprhrodite, does Six confuse love with control? Gaius-Six is technically not exactly fertile. I'd buy Boomer if I didn't like her as Zeus, but if aphrodite creates discord between humans.... what about our kobold episode where Six said one of them would turn on the others. I was making the argument for Crashdown.... but maybe Cally fits here. She's also gotten into fights, and shot sharon. That's a lot of discord. I wasn't believing her as a cylon.... but perhaps the description fits.

For Dionysus, wouldn't Tigh make sense? Okay, god of wine. The only clue we have gotten that Tigh would be a cylon is the same dark side that morgue-sharon had.... dark thoughts. Tigh's dark thought's led him to the bottle (yeah... okay, and to Ellen too.... yikes!). Maybe Tigh's alcoholism is a sign of cylonism.

You know.... Tigh also killed dozens of humans by ordering hatches sealed 45 seconds too early. Cylons wouldn't like one of their own on the bottle and out of control, but also reduces suspicion that he is a cylon.

For now, Six as Athena.... and the others I'm leaving as a human skeleton crew in case all the cylons leave.

10:34 PM  
Anonymous annyihra said...

I don't believe that Starbuck is a Cylon. She was probably implanted with a fetus when she goes back to Caprica, and since the Cylon Humanesques cannot reproduce on their own (excluding Boomer-Caprica, who was an experiment to see if love is the key to reproduction for the Cylons), she is obviously not one. The most suspicious people are Colonel Tigh's wife and Specialist Cally. After all, Cally kills Boomer-Galactica, and that could be programming.

7:54 PM  
Anonymous annyihraf said...

Excuse my verb tense error. :S

9:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You know, I am both relieved and disappointed to find that I am not the only one who has come to this conclusion. I was getting used to the idea that I was the only one. This show is geniusly constructed, a true credit to science fiction, and the reason Ron Moore is my hero. The key is to look at the old series for clues of what is to come. Before I go into the correspondance between the 12 lords of kobol, and the 12 cylon models, I want to first talk about Baltar.
I don't want to spoil the rest of the show for you, and I am absolutely confident about what I am about to say, so if you want to figure it out for yourself, do not read on.
Baltar is a cylon. But it's not as simple as that. As the show progresses (for what I hope will be many seasons), Baltar will assume his place as their leader. For those of you familiar with the doomed original series, this was the original intention of the show's most original creator, Glen Larson, before it was corrupted by greedy network execs seeking to cash in on the Star Wars phenomena. In the original series, Baltar betrays humanity to gain control of the Cylons (before they in turn betray him). You were right on the money in describing Baltar as corresponding to Zeus, where Six corresponds to Hera. In order to understand what is to come, you have to realize that the show is still relatively in its infancy. Ron Moore, David Eick and the SciFi Channel fully intend on making the show go on at least another five or so seasons. At its current stage, Six is still preparing Baltar for this role, by first influencing him to be vice president, and then president. Slowly, he is becoming more sympathetic to the Cylons and is slowly emerging as a leader. Soon, he will take his place as the leader of the Cylons.
As I said before, Baltar represents Zeus, and Six represents Hera. Baltar seems to exhibit even the smallest traits of character that describe Zeus, right down to his promiscuity, and rash arrogance. It's simply a perfect match. I disagree with the notion that Six represents Aphrodite. Six is Hera for several reasons. In Greek mythology, Hera was beautiful and lustful, but also wicked, cruel, jealous, and extremely dominant. The best word to describe her would be firery. Again the match is perfect to Six. In fact, the matches are so perfect, for both Baltar and Six, that I would call this proof of idea there is a correspondence between the Olympians and the show's characters.
I want to throw out a possibility you probably haven't considered. Right now you are confusing Cylons with humans, and trying to use a single set of Olympians to piece apart who is a Cylon and who is not. Consider this. What if there are two sets of Olympian representations that we are dealing with here. One for the cylons, and one for the humans. The show would be an incredible failure at the end, if it suddenly turned out that the entire deck crew were cylons. Remember what Tom Zarek said about Adama, "Zeus is back on his thrown." It makes sense now doesn't it. Count the characters on the show, plus all known cylon agents, and you will quickly find that there are more than 12. In fact, if you assume that of the main human characters, THREE of them are Cylons (I'm not giving away the other two), then the number goes to twelve. The key to determining who is human and who is not lies in the Olympian scheme. Figure out which ones don't belong, and you will have found your cylons. With all the evidence, it is clear to me that what we are dealing with is two seperate groups of Olympians.
But that's just a theory, to be honest, I'm still working with it. Both Baltar and Adama easily correspond to Zeus and no one else, where one is good and one is evil, which leads me to this theory. There is other evidence for this. I'll give you two more I am confident about (I can't write this thing all day), Starbuck represents Aphrodite, where both Valleri and Dualla represent Athena. Read mythical descriptions of their characters and you'll understand why. There's another theory I've been toying with. In ancient greek mythology there was a war in heaven, for heaven, between the Olympians and the Titans. The Olympians were the children of the Titans, who won the war and conquered heaven. Sound familiar? All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again.
That's all I have for now, I hope people are still reading this weblog. Also, to add one to your list, Galactica itself represents Mount Olympus (hence the name Galactica in the first place). I hope this entry has helped. I have more, such as the full intentions of the Cylons, the child, and why Six and Baltar keep calling it there own child (there actually is a very good explanation), if you would like to hear them. Tell me what you think.

- Drew
superdrew515@mail.utexas.edu

2:23 AM  
Anonymous Narceron said...

Wow

This is great stuff. I agree that Adama is definitely the human Zeus, but I have a hard time identifying gaius as the cylon counterpart.

Trying not to mix metaphors, here, but it makes more sense for him to remain human, if they are going to follow the series that he creates an entirely new race of godlings, stronger than either of its progenitors.

11:36 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have been toying with this theory for a while myself, however, I totally disagree with many of the cylon/olympian comparisons. Here's the list I have and the reasons for them.

Zeus - unknown/unmet Cylon (Baltar is HUMAN not cylon)
Hera - De'anna Biers (she is the one who is depicted as "in charge" the most
Poseidon - unknown/unmet
Demeter - unknown/unmet
Hades - Brother Caval (Spiritual leader)
Aphrodite - Number 6/Gina
Apollo - Leoben (due to the prophecies)
Artemis - Sharon (huntress)
Athena - unknown/unmet
Hermes - cylon PR guy (who deals with communications)
Dionysus - unknown/unmet
Hephaestus - Simon (working on creating new human/cylon hybrid)

3:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

On the episode "Torn", a suggestion was made to call Boomer Athena.

Adama is Zeus. He runs the Battlestar, he runs the show. He straightened out his subordinate gods Tigh (Hermes) and Starbuck (Artemis). Now Olympus (Battlestar Galactica) is alright. Notice every cylon introduced so far cept for the black guy came onboard the Galactica and were thrown out of "Olympus".

Baltar is Hades.
Lee is Appollo.
etc..

7:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

LOL. You guys are off track with this one. The number 12 is a very ancient sacred number, the dodecathon that goes back to the early Mediterranean predecessors of both the Greeks and Romans and whom both peoples inherited. According to the oldest myths, there were 12 ruling deities who were the first beings and children of heaven and earth. In Greek myth in particular there were 12 Titans-- 6 males and 6 females. They were soon replaced by 12 Olympians again 6 males and 6 females. The number 12 is prominent because not only does it feature in the number of deities but the zodiac, months of the year etc.

Now, as to my personal theory I agree that the Cylons detest the polytheism but that doesn't mean they wouldn't employ the ancient number or don't believe in any of the ancient legends at all as shown by Sharon who states that she and the other Cylons know more about the myths than most humans.

The the most ancient theme in old Mediterranean (Neolithic ?) myths of both the Greeks as well as the Hebrews in the Bible was the great cycle-- death and rebirth.

The 12 refugee tribes who fled from the destruction of Kobol's civilization, only to be reborn as the 12 Colonies which were then again came close to extinction with the Cylon attacks.

In the most recent episodes, the Cylons make it clear that they too are looking for "a new beginning". I believe the Cylons also follow the same pattern of 6 males and 6 females.

Among the males we know of are #5 (Aaron Doral), Leoben Conoy, Simon (black dude), and Cavil (priest)

The known female models are #6 (Caprica/Gina etc.), #8 (Sharon/Boomer), #3 (D'anna Biers).

Which means there are 2 more male models and 3 more female models.

Also, I seriously doubt Lee Adama is one of them!! Both Lee and his father are humans...

BUT I'd seriously keep a close eye on his wife Dualla! Something tells me she is a Cylon in deep sleeper mode.

One thing I've noticed is that as much as the Cylons hate humanity they always seem to be finding ways to "couple" with humans. Sharon with Helo, Six with Gaius. Which seems to be part of their mission of a new beginning. Well Lee is married to Dualla, so I won't be surprised if this is another Cylon-human coupling.

10:15 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The other problem with your scheme, which I think is starting down the right track, is that identifying the 12 Lords of Kobol and the 12 Lords with the Olympians is that there is a 13th tribe! who should have most likely had a corresponding Lord. That this lord has been apparently excised from the Colonies memory hints possibly at the Cylon "one" god, which I think is going to turn out to be a Lord of Kobol who tried to assert dominance--remember, the Cylons know the Colonies' religion better than they do according to Athena on Kobol.
It helps that identifying an actual 12 Olympians is actually pretty difficult since Hades and Hestia can are sometimes included in the "count". I'm pretty sure that there are arguably others as well.
A better course might be to pursue the more overt hints we've been given- corresponding the twelve models to the twelve signs of the zodiac, after which the tribes and colonies are named.

8:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You know, I am both relieved and disappointed to find that I am not the only one who has come to this conclusion. I was getting used to the idea that I was the only one. This show is geniusly constructed, a true credit to science fiction, and the reason Ron Moore is my hero. The key is to look at the old series for clues of what is to come. Before I go into the correspondance between the 12 lords of kobol, and the 12 cylon models, I want to first talk about Baltar.
I don't want to spoil the rest of the show for you, and I am absolutely confident about what I am about to say, so if you want to figure it out for yourself, do not read on.
Baltar is a cylon. But it's not as simple as that. As the show progresses (for what I hope will be many seasons), Baltar will assume his place as their leader. For those of you familiar with the doomed original series, this was the original intention of the show's most original creator, Glen Larson, before it was corrupted by greedy network execs seeking to cash in on the Star Wars phenomena. In the original series, Baltar betrays humanity to gain control of the Cylons (before they in turn betray him). You were right on the money in describing Baltar as corresponding to Zeus, where Six corresponds to Hera. In order to understand what is to come, you have to realize that the show is still relatively in its infancy. Ron Moore, David Eick and the SciFi Channel fully intend on making the show go on at least another five or so seasons. At its current stage, Six is still preparing Baltar for this role, by first influencing him to be vice president, and then president. Slowly, he is becoming more sympathetic to the Cylons and is slowly emerging as a leader. Soon, he will take his place as the leader of the Cylons.
As I said before, Baltar represents Zeus, and Six represents Hera. Baltar seems to exhibit even the smallest traits of character that describe Zeus, right down to his promiscuity, and rash arrogance. It's simply a perfect match. I disagree with the notion that Six represents Aphrodite. Six is Hera for several reasons. In Greek mythology, Hera was beautiful and lustful, but also wicked, cruel, jealous, and extremely dominant. The best word to describe her would be firery. Again the match is perfect to Six. In fact, the matches are so perfect, for both Baltar and Six, that I would call this proof of idea there is a correspondence between the Olympians and the show's characters.
I want to throw out a possibility you probably haven't considered. Right now you are confusing Cylons with humans, and trying to use a single set of Olympians to piece apart who is a Cylon and who is not. Consider this. What if there are two sets of Olympian representations that we are dealing with here. One for the cylons, and one for the humans. The show would be an incredible failure at the end, if it suddenly turned out that the entire deck crew were cylons. Remember what Tom Zarek said about Adama, "Zeus is back on his thrown." It makes sense now doesn't it. Count the characters on the show, plus all known cylon agents, and you will quickly find that there are more than 12. In fact, if you assume that of the main human characters, THREE of them are Cylons (I'm not giving away the other two), then the number goes to twelve. The key to determining who is human and who is not lies in the Olympian scheme. Figure out which ones don't belong, and you will have found your cylons. With all the evidence, it is clear to me that what we are dealing with is two seperate groups of Olympians.
But that's just a theory, to be honest, I'm still working with it. Both Baltar and Adama easily correspond to Zeus and no one else, where one is good and one is evil, which leads me to this theory. There is other evidence for this. I'll give you two more I am confident about (I can't write this thing all day), Starbuck represents Aphrodite, where both Valleri and Dualla represent Athena. Read mythical descriptions of their characters and you'll understand why. There's another theory I've been toying with. In ancient greek mythology there was a war in heaven, for heaven, between the Olympians and the Titans. The Olympians were the children of the Titans, who won the war and conquered heaven. Sound familiar? All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again.
That's all I have for now, I hope people are still reading this weblog. Also, to add one to your list, Galactica itself represents Mount Olympus (hence the name Galactica in the first place). I hope this entry has helped. I have more, such as the full intentions of the Cylons, the child, and why Six and Baltar keep calling it there own child (there actually is a very good explanation), if you would like to hear them. Tell me what you think.

- Drew
superdrew515@mail.utexas.edu



Drew,
Please elaborate on your view on the intentions of the cylons, the child and why Baltar and six think the child is theirs. I would love to hear more of your thoughts.

L

10:49 AM  
Anonymous ceti said...

Dunno when the last post was, but we are seeing more and more of the characters line up by name with the Olympian gods including:

Zeus = Adama

Hera = Athena and Helo's child

Artemis/Diana = D'anna Biers (by name

Ares = Chief and Cally's kid (who was dedicated to Ares)

Apollo = Lee
Helios = Helo (however, Apollo took Helios' place on Olympus)

and just in, Aurora = Starbuck (the idol she was holding in Maelstrom, and her role as the dawn of something new)

Gods and goddesses like Aphrodite, Poseidon, and Hephaestus have such odd names, that it will take longer to maneuver the characters literally into these roles -- that is unless the Roman names are used. "Eye of Jupiter" may have signaled that they may be interchangeable in the mythology of the show.

Gaius might be the jealous "one" God who prompted the exodus in the first place, thus his Jesus-like appearance of late.

It will be interesting to see if they find Earth as where the one God prevailed at the expense of the other gods who with the twelve colonies moved outwards, rather than returned back from Kobol (assuming here that Earth was the original home of humans, and that what will happen has happened again in a cyclical pattern).

8:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tigh = God of Wine =)

4:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I belive the 12 cylons represent the 12 lost tribes of israel which links the abrahamic tradition that they follow, one God. This would then possibly be explained re Earth following the abrahamic model and the 12 lost tribes of Israel being the lost colonies (for those who went to Earth. Just a feeling, could be wrong but interesting to see how it all plays out...and would then explain how they are all interlinked i.e. Earth, the colonies and the cylons, really with one core belief but different interpretations (kind of mirrors human history doesn't it?).

5:41 AM  
Blogger Jane said...

Brilliant! you are awesome. thank you for this very cool analysis, I love thinking of six and baltar as hera and zeus.

10:40 AM  
Anonymous wmaria said...

two years later and watching the dvds I got to the same conclusion. Here is how I think it should go:

Zeus: Adama
Hera:Madame President
Appollo:Lee
Artemis: Starbuck
Dionysus: Gaius
Boomer:Aphrodite????
Hephestus: Chief(the husband of Aphrodite originaly)
Hares: Halo-(the god of war she fell in love with)
Poseidon:the xo
Hermes:Duala (the messanger)

I don't have a candidate for Hestia-but she doesn;t do much in the greek mythology so its difficul to place her. Also I m not sure who Athena should be.

If Boomer is Athena then Halo can't be Ares.
But then Six could be Afrodite.

Well that's my theory-and since this post officialy makes e a geek i will go away and cry:)....

4:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now that we know that Chief Tyrol is a Cylon he has to be Dionysus, gets pretty clear when you keep in mind that he is brewing bouze on deck. Ares i think si anders him beeing an ensign on galactica, tigh actually no ideea could be ares, could be hermes(exo he kind of relays all the admirals commands) maybe poseidon but no ideea, tory could be artemis didnt she help in hiding the baby?

12:52 PM  
Blogger Punkboy Buddha said...

just a quick correct before y'all go too far. dionysis and hades are not an olympian. hades is 3rd in command, but he doesn't sit on the mount.
zeus, hera, poseiden, demeter, and hestia are 5 and the first generation. aphrodite, apollo, ares, artemis, athena, hephaestus and hermes are 7 and second generation. intersting?

7:14 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'll go one further. I don't think the 12 models correspond to the 12 gods - I think they are. Repeated discussion of cycles. Once they get to earth, 12 new people will be chosen as leaders that will guide humanity forward. They will be given the ability to resurrect. At some point, 5 of them will feel it's time to let go of control and let humanity develop without them. They fade into the background, while all of them forget their original purpose over generations. The last cylon is Posideon, and I thik it's the cylon ship controller. The question is who will be the next chosen 12. - My .02

8:38 PM  

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